Thoughts on Cheney

[Robert J. Yates]

"The problem we have run into, producing vaccine is not a very profitable business"

But he wasted no time in getting his. Nice excuse, nice leadership

[Art Welch]

It's not a nice reality in this case but it is the truth, the opportunity for profit is what drives both investment and innovation. If there were more to be made here then perhaps Chiron would have more competition and we wouldn't have a vaccine problem now. But then if prices were higher I'm sure there would be a very loud collective howl about that too.

Maybe government subsides to encourage production are the answer, I don't like that approach but maybe it is appropriate in this case.

[cbassett]

Originally posted by Robert J. Yates
"The problem we have run into, producing vaccine is not a very profitable business"

But he wasted no time in getting his. Nice excuse, nice leadership

Lessee here, 2nd man in charge of country.... give him his vaccine.

[Robert J. Yates]

Originally posted by Art Welch
Maybe government subsides to encourage production are the answer, I don't like that approach but maybe it is appropriate in this case.

It used to be that our government took a benevolent approach with vaccinations against disease. Good health of the American citizen was seen to be in the national interest and the profitability of the vaccination program was considered to be a price to pay for that good health. This country used to openly brag about its success in combating disease.

So using that example, I question why Cheney brought in the issue of profitability. Given the potential of the flu epidemic turning out to be as severe as expected, there will be a huge social cost in lost work hours and added strain on an already strained health care network.

If we are going to discuss profitability, it makes no sense to simply confine it to the companies producing the vaccine. There are other definitions of profit.

he still wasted no time in getting his shot though. What makes him so special - we do not have royalty in this country that I am aware of

[Art Welch]

I don't disagree with the importance of the issue but he is just reporting the truth:

Well, the problem we've run into is producing vaccine is not a very profitable business. We're down now, I guess, to two producers. And it's a combination of the economics of the business. You can produce millions of doses, but if people don't take it, then you have to throw it out because it's only good for one year, and then it has to be renewed, so it's not necessarily a very profitable business for companies to be in.

Profitability is at the center of the current situation and to ignore it would be naive. It would have been nice however if he had proposed solutions in addition to pointing this out.

Again, perhaps it is appropriate for government involvement here in the form of encouraging competition and production (and I'm about as anti-government involvement as can be).

[cbassett]

Originally posted by Robert J. Yates
he still wasted no time in getting his shot though.

Agreed there. I've received the flu shot once, as far as I recall, and I got sicker that flu season that I have in a long time.

[Jeff Weston]

Originally posted by cbassett
Agreed there. I've received the flu shot once, as far as I recall, and I got sicker that flu season that I have in a long time.

Bingo! I got my first flu shot ever last year and got the flu for the first time in I don't know how long. I was a hurting puppy for four days straight (which happened to coincide just after we came home with a newborn so my wife had to take care of 4 babies instead of 3 ) No more flu shots for me.

I have 27 month old twins and a 7 month old. Guess which one got a 1/2 dose of the shot and the others got nothing due to shortage ... the 27 month old boy because he had a brief breathing problem when he was 1 year old.

As for profitability, I would've thought that in light of last year's shortage, companies would anticipate the high demand, therefore higher profits.

[LeadFoot]

Originally posted by Robert J. Yates
"The problem we have run into, producing vaccine is not a very profitable business"

But he wasted no time in getting his. Nice excuse, nice leadership

Yeah, to heck with Cheney and Bush! After all, they kept Reeve from walking!

[Robert J. Yates]

Originally posted by LeadFoot
After all, they kept Reeve from walking!

No Reeve kept himself from walking - he prejumped his horse who decided to stop. His own damn fault.

[cbassett]

Originally posted by Robert J. Yates
No Reeve kept himself from walking - he prejumped his horse who decided to stop. His own damn fault.

Someone ought to sue the horse's trainer!

[Stu Olson]

Originally posted by cbassett
Someone ought to sue the horse's trainer!

The horse already did, and won! They put the trainer down.

[Bruce David]

Originally posted by Robert J. Yates
It used to be that our government took a benevolent approach with vaccinations against disease. Good health of the American citizen was seen to be in the national interest and the profitability of the vaccination program was considered to be a price to pay for that good health. This country used to openly brag about its success in combating disease.

So using that example, I question why Cheney brought in the issue of profitability. Given the potential of the flu epidemic turning out to be as severe as expected, there will be a huge social cost in lost work hours and added strain on an already strained health care network.

If we are going to discuss profitability, it makes no sense to simply confine it to the companies producing the vaccine. There are other definitions of profit.

he still wasted no time in getting his shot though. What makes him so special - we do not have royalty in this country that I am aware of

He has some serous health issues. Bad ticker and ?...
And the fact that he is second in command

[Robert J. Yates]

Originally posted by cbassett
Someone ought to sue the horse's trainer!

Didn't that ambulance chaser Edwards already do that

[Robert J. Yates]

Originally posted by Bruce David
He has some serous health issues. Bad ticker and ?...
And the fact that he is second in command

Used to be women and children first, and the captain goes down with the ship

[Paradiddle]

Cheney is a scarey old man. A true greedhead and a sadist. He's probably a beater of women and an abuser of prescription pain killers.

His only interest is money and death - his money and someone else death.

Thank God W is young - even if he almost died eating a snack food...

[Robert J. Yates]

Originally posted by whatttup_G
material is gettin thin here... time to play a race card or scare elderly or children

Yea, wheres' Willy Horton when you need him

[LeadFoot]

Originally posted by Robert J. Yates
No Reeve kept himself from walking - he prejumped his horse who decided to stop. His own damn fault.

My point in saying that is because Edwards/Kerry blamed Reeves handi-cap on Bush because he did not spend more millions and millions on stem cell research. I'm really not a fan of either Kerry or Bush, but in my view Kerry has more downfalls, not to mention he wants to re-inforce Clinton's clean water act, which will severly limit the amount of trails (at least around here). In one old issue of Dirt Bike that I have, I remember it saying that with it in full effect, any motorized vehicles will be banned from water crossings and also it would be illegal to ride horses across a creek or whatnot. Is the act going to stop rednecks who live 20miles away from anyone? No, but it will reduce the amount of trails on legal wheel-able areas, again, at least in this area.

[Overkill]

Originally posted by whatttup_G
whats offensive about the whole stem cell chris reeve thing is the notion that someone is blocking a known solution to paralysis or that the spending of billions and harvesting humans for science would absolutely supply a cure.. these are unknowns at best, moral stance not required... but its bull S to get ppl stuck in wheelchairs and whatnot all worked up for political motives... some party for the middle class


and just look at the work on the common cold, anyone can go double barrel at that, research is free and doesn't need a fetus for bait..... look how well that's going


again... F kerry with a garden weasel

I wish that those claming what you're referring to would find clear proof that stem cell research can lead to a cure for anything.

I cannot prove nor disprove it, but don't state something as fact unless you have some clear and concise evidence to back that up. One or 2 trade journal articles based on the authors opinion doesn't count.

:agree:

Anyway, on the vaccine... I'm not happy we have such a shortage, HOWEVER, I'd rather have those running this country getting it first, really, them being sick only raises more problems.

(quit yerr bitchin)

[cbassett]

Finally someone formed a response to OK's post. He seemed to be arguing both sides of the fence, so I was pondering which side to offend!

[TObject]

Stem cells can convert or develop into other cells in the human body. Here is one of perspective ways stem cells could be used in the near future:

Say you lost a leg in a car accident. A doctor takes a small sample of your blood, puts it in a machine that makes comprehensive deconvolution analyses, and designs a drug system that is specific to your genetic blueprint. You take the drugs, and they force your organism to send stem cells from your spine column and grow you a new leg.