Okay, am I crazy?

[William]

My wife and I have had the debate about her getting a SUV of some kind. Landrover: out. She doesn't want a cherokee or grand. She'd like some huge land yatch, but nothing doing by me. We've been looking at tons of options, and nothing would fit the bill of everything we'd like to do. But I've decided to spring one on her that would be kind of cool.

I'm thinking of getting a slightly used TJSE automatic. It seems that they are a little bit economical (compared to my 13mpg, and her 21, 18mpg in a SE is good middle line). She admits that a white jeep with Tan interior is "cute". This is a cue for me to build a plan.

I'm thinking of getting a TJSE, automatic (she can't drive a stick, she can barely drive Jeep offroad right now as it is). I would put a one inch body lift, SYE for a flat skid, Kilby skid, some sort of body rock rails (like the currie ones) and 31's. A nice stereo and a hard top would make it comfortable for her (perhaps I could score some Sahara seats), and it'd be distinctive enough for her. That, coupled with a true trac in the rear would make for a really decent offroad vehicle that she could comfortably do most trails up to her want, and she could then make it out to camp with me when I'm out wheeling. Realisticly, this wouldn't cost a huge chunk of change, and we could keep her car for me to be a daily driver, or for her (and I'd drive the SE for work).

Please poke holes in this idea as much as possible. I'm trying to find all the pro's and cons.

[TObject]

Originally posted by William
She admits that a white jeep with Tan interior is "cute".

She does have a point!

If you are going to drive that TJ on freeways, get a 6 cylinder.

[William]

Originally posted by TObject

She does have a point!

If you are going to drive that TJ on freeways, get a 6 cylinder.

Nope. Nope. Nope. NOOOO.

That leads to D44s. 35's. Lockers. Lifts.

Nothing doing. This is strickly a decent commuter.

Shoot with our dead slow traffic, who needs speed...

[Paradiddle]

Overall sounds like a good plan. I agree with Sergey - you should get the 6. I know the mileage isn't as good, but in the long run I think you'll be unhappy with the 4.

The only issue I could see is the complete lack of space in a TJ. You have one child now - correct? If you guys add another you are now OUT of space. Hell - can you even fit a stroller in the back of a TJ?

XJ baby - she wants an XJ!!!

Throw a 3" lift and some 31's and you have great trail vehicle that holds stuff.

Jeff

[Robert J. Yates]

Originally posted by William
She'd like some huge land yatch, but nothing doing by me.

I am glad to see that you vetoed that William but it got me to wondering why all these tiny women have to have the biggest land yacht around? They can't even see over the hoods LOL. Watching them attempt to park those beasts is better than watching most of what is on TV these days. Maybe these women are over-compensating for lacking something?

[William]

Originally posted by Robert J. Yates
Watching them attempt to park those beasts is better than watching most of what is on TV these days.

Don't even get me started on that.

I love my wife, but shoot, her parking skills leave something to be desired. A SWB is about perfect in that department.

[William]

Originally posted by Paradiddle
[B]The only issue I could see is the complete lack of space in a TJ. You have one child now - correct? If you guys add another you are now OUT of space. Hell - can you even fit a stroller in the back of a TJ?

We'd have two TJ's at that point. One for wheeling, and one to come out and meet me at the trail. We'd keep her car for weekend stuff around town, church, mall driving and crap like that.

I have dibs on a 89 XJ. 1500 dollars. Way to much work to get anywhere near something she'd want to drive (She's picky, and she lives with me, so she's suffered from low standards already..).

And, not to flame anyone, or belittle choices or anything.. But unibodies make me nervous. One thing comes to mind. Derf on updown hill unable to close his rear hatch. I'll wheel with anyone in a bus! And likely they could outdrive me to no end (of course that doesn't say much, I'm still learning to two foot the gas and brake pedals). Shalom has made every trail I ever have that we've been on together, and with much less body damage, and far less use of a strap. But owning one is really a different story. It's just a personnel preference.

[Paradiddle]

Buy her this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eb...690817&r=0&t=0

Jeff

[William]

Jeff,

I wonder how many cars she'd run over learning to park that?

[Paradiddle]

William - I'm not sure that XJ does anything but go straight - how in gods name do you turn with meat like that???

Jeff

[William]

Exactly!

Honey?

Yes.

I ran over a car today.

Really? What did you hit today ?

Um, a school bus.

That's nice..



Nope, no big battle wagons in this house..

[speaceman]

I'm going to say it again. I know i've said it before.... I know I sound like i'm beating a dead horse with it's own stiff leg....

But why again don't you want to get an XJ or a ZJ?

My dad got his 2000 XJ, with 8 months on it and 7K miles. It still smelled new. I-6, Power everything, but none of the stupid options like the compass or outside temp gauge. $18K out the door.

You could get a 98 zj limited(v-8) with relatively low miliage maybe 30-40k (last time I looked), with every bell and whistle for somewhere in the $18-$20s

Now I understand your worries about the Unibody.

There are a couple of points that you need to really think about. I know you say you have thought about them, but maybe you need to think about them again.

1. You are saying you just want a vehicle to bum around on easy trails. A unibody jeep will hold up for this. I have been doing a bit more than that, and my ZJ has held up fine. I am expecting to have problems with the Unibody eventually. From what I've seen, people with a bit older ZJ's do run into cracks and such.

That is an issue you can deal with as you get to it and if you are doing easy trails, I don't think it will even become and issue for you.

2. Everything you have stated about your wants for this 2nd vehicle points to an XJ or a ZJ. My dad's XJ gets 16-22 MPG in it's stock configuration, real world driving. Mine gets about 15 city and around 22 highway, in it's current configuration (it's all about the 4 speed auto). You will have the extra room you want, it is enclosed and it will ride decently and quietly. Plus you want an vehicle that will offroad. You've seen what XJ and ZJs can do with your own eyes.

3. If you are still really worried about the unibody (you have commented about XJs a lot), I would go with a 97 or 98 ZJ. They had some unibody upgrades, and I have spent some time under both mine and my dad's jeep and I have to say the ZJ unibody is a bit beefier. There are subframes sandwiched in the unibody rails, where I haven't seen this on an XJ. (Although the XJ is lighter, so maybe that's the difference).

If you are planning simple mods, it probably doesn't matter which you go with. They will probably end up costing the same. Although for the same $, you will get around a 2 year younger XJ than a ZJ.

The ZJ does have a bit more room (especially headroom and trunk space) and does ride nicer. Although I like the sportier feel of the stock XJ.

I would suggest, that you find a nice XJ and a nice ZJ and have your wife drive them around a bit. She might change her mind. I did the second I test drove my ZJ.

Plus, if she really wants to be different, just buy her an ARB bull bar. You don't see too many of those on XJ's or ZJs. Or tell her you'll paint it barbie pink for her.

All of the above is not ment to try and convince you want to do. It's just observations I have after driving my jeep, my dad's jeep, and my sister's jeep around. (I usually do the driving if the family is going somewhere. I have spent a bit of time in all 3).

[TObject]

Can you name the truck with four wheel drive,
Smells like a steak, and seats thirty five?
Canyonero! Canyonero!
Well, it goes real slow with the hammer down
It's the country-fried truck endorsed by a clown
Canyonero! Canyonero!
Hey, hey!
Twelve yards long, two lanes wide,
Sixty five tons of American pride!
Canyonero! Canyonero!
Top of the line in utility sports,
Unexplained fires are a matter for the courts!
Canyonero! Canyonero!
She blinds everybody with her super high beams
She's a squirrel-squashin', deer-smackin' drivin' machine
Canyonero! Canyonero! Canyonero!
Whoa, Canyonero! Whoa!

[Paradiddle]

The 98 and newer XJ is considerable stiffer than the previous XJs.

That said - the undersite of my WJ was beef - much stiffer than the XJ or the ZJ from what I've heard. The parts were definately thicker (like the pinch weld, etc.)

William - we just can't wait to welcome you into the bus family

Think of the razzing you'll get from Garry and Blaine - are you man enough to handle it!?!?!?!?

Jeff

[speaceman]

Yeah, from what I have seen and read, Jeep took the lessons they learned from the XJ, to build the 93-96 ZJ unibody.

Then when they had to strengthen the front subframe for the dual air-bags, they beefed it up more for 96-98. Then they took those specs and made them even beefier for the WJ. I don't think the WJ will really have unibody problems unless you are hanging D60s off of it or it is wheeled A LOT.

I've seen the WJ frame. It is noticably stronger. Especially areas like the body mounts and such.

Although, I woudln't buy a 99WJ if you paid me, considering how many complaints there were.

[William]

Originally posted by Paradiddle
Think of the razzing you'll get from Garry and Blaine - are you man enough to handle it!?!?!?!?

Jeff

Blaine's the guy with the bus stop sign outside of his house.

I'll have pictures soon to prove it!!!!

[TJRON]

You asked for opinions. Here's mine.
Yes, you are crazy. You need another TJ like you need a hole in the head. They are about the lousiest family transportation car I could imagine. Your wife can meet you on the trail in most any car imaginable. You need some room for things. If you ever plan on taking a trip some day in a comfortable vehicle the TJ is out.
If you want to get another TJ and mod it, just do it. Don't try to justify it 'cause you can't.
Ron

[speaceman]

You like Nissans, how about an Xterra? That'll do everything you want it to do. There are the cute-utes too, like the Rav4, the CRV, the Ford Escape, etc.

Those aren't good either?

[TObject]

May I recommend Autobianchi Primula?

[Paradiddle]

Sergey - now THAT rules.

Jeff

[HIGLET]

Originally posted by TJRON
You asked for opinions. Here's mine.
Yes, you are crazy. You need another TJ like you need a hole in the head. They are about the lousiest family transportation car I could imagine. Your wife can meet you on the trail in most any car imaginable. You need some room for things. If you ever plan on taking a trip some day in a comfortable vehicle the TJ is out.
If you want to get another TJ and mod it, just do it. Don't try to justify it 'cause you can't.
Ron

It's the subtlty (sp) I love

He's right you know William

[Wumpy]

Originally posted by TJRON
You asked for opinions. Here's mine.
Yes, you are crazy. You need another TJ like you need a hole in the head. They are about the lousiest family transportation car I could imagine. Your wife can meet you on the trail in most any car imaginable. You need some room for things. If you ever plan on taking a trip some day in a comfortable vehicle the TJ is out.
If you want to get another TJ and mod it, just do it. Don't try to justify it 'cause you can't.
Ron

You know Ron, I could call you an ass for your response. But you're honest, and to the point. To many people worry about the approach in life, and the result, they circumvent the point. Popular term from our mutual friend "circle speak".

You are right, and you are wrong. And as I talked with Blaine about this.. and thought it over from everyone's input.

The car wouldn't be family transportation. I like my TJ for transportation because really, I could care. If I got a daily driver car - it'd be beater POS that didn't cost much and didn't fall apart. Other wise it could be chartouse, and I wouldn't care. However, it would wear off.

As much as I don't want it to be true in some respects, my wife is an image consicous person. The novelty of a TJ would wear off.. and she'd hate it. I may not like this small fact, but I love my wife, and this is part of her.

Part of it is, she wanted to drive once and did. The jeep was a little much for her at the moment. Shoot, right now, my jeep is a bit much for me (I don't want to say that, but it's true, I'm learning to drive my "new" jeep). So, part of what I wanted was to make something that was cool apart from others, and with a little learning curve in it for her so she could wheel a little. I tried to justify it as a "capable trail jeep". It wasn't purely motivated for her, but she was about 1/2 of it. But, really, most SUV's will make it down a dusty fire road or over a few small rocks. No mods needed.

Perhaps I just enjoy the build up a little, it is fun planning, and building. I think the other part is I want her to be able to join in, and if I remove some of the obsticles, she'd be more willing. I enjoy a lot of things about my jeep. And I want her to be part. Sometimes, I don't want her to be discluded. I guess I need to leave that more up to her than me. We both are trying to find a middle ground for it.

A TJSE seemed like a good idea.

Nope, not really.

So, you're right that I didn't need it, and that it wasn't a gonna work. We'd keep her current car (paid for and will run for a looonnnggg time.).

Wrong in the fact that I'm trying to justify a jeep purchase to build up. Mine isn't done.. so I've got enough on my hands trying to justify money I need to spend on it!!

Ron, I'm glad I've met you. Because knowing you makes it easy to understand your ideas for what they are:

honest advice.

I heard a comment once "Gray hair dudes ROCK!!".

Must be true!!

[TJRON]

William,
My wife and I have a 4x4 Jeep and a 4x4 truck. When it came time for her to replace her '87 Pathfinder she wanted an Xterra. I told her she was nuts and needed a small 4x4 SUV like she needed another hole in the head. Why not a more luxurious car that got good mileage? She's had the Xterra for a year and a half now and loves it. It has seen one dirt road and may never see another.
I guess my point is if my wife won't take my advise seriously, I sure wouldn't expect you to!
Ron

[TObject]

Xterra has more inside room than a TJ. Even though it?s kinda new, I think it is ok to buy one, even the first year of production. Front seats forward it is basically the Frontier truck. I rejected it because I didn?t know where to put my legs. But you may like it, check it out, if you can get over the fact that its rearend is butt-ugly.

[Paradiddle]

The xterra is nice - but it's really just an XJ for girls.

At that point you might as well get a Liberty.

[speaceman]

Originally posted by Paradiddle
The xterra is nice - but it's really just an XJ for girls.

At that point you might as well get a Liberty.

Have you really looked at a liberty?

They are tiny. Not much bigger than a TJ really. I was shocked at how little trunk space there is compared to an XJ.

It's weird considering it's supposed to be the XJ replacement.

I'm not sure what Jeep's rational was, considering the XJ was almost small enough to be considered a cute-ute. I mean it's not much bigger than a Ford Escape.

THe liberty does look pretty good on a 2 inch BB and 31's though. There is one built like that down the street from me.

[TObject]

Liberty is also heavier than XJ. It seems like a step backwards to me.

[Scott]

William, I don't think you are crazy. Heck, Id do it if I had the money A little off topic, but did anyone else notice that XJ on 39" boggers had a D35 rear?? YIKES.
Scott