How does a loose chain affect my t-case?

[LeadFoot]

I'm here to learn, thats why Im asking.

I never poped mine open yet (been too cold! average temp is 7deg). How does a loose chain effect the 4wd engaging? I looked at the pics at JU.

http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...hreadid=341259

Theres no way the chain can slip on the teeth, is there? It gets really get bad when I attempt to make a turn. Is it possible that several parts of the gears chipped off? I have no idea. If it looks damaged too much, would it be easier for me to buy a used good one? I cant afford a new one at $700. Thanks!!!

[Scott Hill]

1st off move 7 deg is way to cold


2nd having had a few casses apart I don,t that the chain is what you should look at. thet can stretch but would really have to be screwed to slip HD chains are not worth it the stock one is strong check the other partsfor wear.



Scott

[karstman]

Originally posted by Scott Hill
1st off move 7 deg is way to cold

7 is not bad. It's the -20 wind chill that really stinks. My propane torch froze last night in my work van. I had to thaw it out before it would light

[Scott Hill]

You guys REALLY Need to be here I found it hard to ypt cause my garage is in the 50's



Scott

[Scott Hill]

Oh and last thing to check the t-case with out taking it apart check the linkage so you know it is all the way engagedcould save you a lot of time.

if you look at the chain more stuff can brake beforethe chain goes it starts with something else.



Scott

[Mark Hinkley]

Yes a worn/streched chain can jump on the sprokets under load. The only way to really tell is by looking at the sprokets and seeing if there are grooves on the points of the teeth. (their not exactly points but you get the area I'm talking about that way)

I haven't ever heard of a way to measure a chain. They can stretch with heat so it's hard to say what is going on after driving it for a while.

Hd chains aren't worth the money, just use a good stock replacement.

Just remember check the linkage and rule it out that the thing isn't engaging all the way first. Both sound simular but a streched chain will usually show itself under load while climbing or while turing, both while in 4lo.

good luck, my first and only streched chain took a long time to diagnose because it's not to well know about.

Mark
orgs mfg

[Scott Hill]

Mark,
stop smoking crack

how the hel do you get the 231 chain to pop over or off a tooth This I would like to see.

[LeadFoot]

Thanks for all of the replys, I am going to have to check out the linkage. More pieces to throw in the puzzle. I have posi-lok installed, and with it disengaged, I can have the t-case in low range (or high) and it will be fine. As soon as I engage the posi-lok, the trouble starts.

[karstman]

Originally posted by LeadFoot
As soon as I engage the posi-lok, the trouble starts.

Can you describe the trouble in more detail?

[LeadFoot]

Originally posted by karstman
Can you describe the trouble in more detail?

I'll try my best. Mind you, this happens ONLY with the T-case in 4wd (high, low) AND posi-lok engaged. If I drive in a straight line, about every 5 feet or so (rougly) I'll feel this little thump. At the end of my driveway, I attempted to make a normal turn (not sharp) on loose ground. The whole Jeep bucks, but still goes forward. I felt it at the bottom of my seat, which leads me to believe its coming from the tranny/tcase area.

However, with the front axle NOT engaged, it will NOT make any weird quirks whatsoever. I can play in 4wd H and 4wd L as much as I want, and it will work fine. This baffles me, because if it was a tcase linkage problem, wouldnt it do it whenever im in 4h or 4l, reguardless wheter posi-lok is engaged? This Jeep stuff really korn-fuses me.

[Mark Hinkley]

It happens.

Doesn't all SH!T happen.

Don't D60 u-joints break?

231 chains will jump/slip teeth on sprokets.



mark "I won't lie just to give someone sh!t" Hinkley
orgs mfg

[Stu Olson]

How long has your YJ had this problem?

[LeadFoot]

Originally posted by Stu Olson
How long has your YJ had this problem?

Ever since I bought it (used). The guy before me was a real west virginian hoopie. Heres a pic of the engine compartment after he installed the weber carb. He left practically all of the hoses attachted to it. This was taken about the day I bought it. http://jeepman.8m.com/2Y030078.jpg

http://jeepman.8m.com/2Y030080.jpg

Imagine about half of those hoses gone, thats what it looks like now. I really should get a updated pic.

Green=94(parents), 87= silver(mine)

http://jeepman.8m.com/2Y030084.jpg

It did it with the stock vaccum CAD.

[LeadFoot]

The reason I posted the pics is because if he messed up a weber carb install, how do I know the bozo didnt go mall crusing in 4wd?

[Scott Hill]

Mark,

I still want to see it

[Jerry Bransford]

LeadFoot, is this happening only on a paved surface? Does it do it on loose dirt or solid snow too?

[LeadFoot]

Originally posted by Jerry Bransford
LeadFoot, is this happening only on a paved surface? Does it do it on loose dirt or solid snow too?

It hardly ever sees the road, its not street legal.

All testing is done in about 4-5" of snow, on grass ground. No such thing as loose dirt, every thing is frozen about a foot and a half deep.

[Mark Hinkley]

Well we'll need to first stuff you inside a worn out 231.......

Smoking crack maybe needed.......

mark

[LeadFoot]

I believe you ARE smoking crack.

[Scott Hill]

Mark,

me or Hinkley has been hitting the pipe to much.

I know it can be done but seeing knowing it is built I really want to see a chain streched enough to slip in person and know that was the only thing wrong wit the t-case

I have taleked and looked at this peoblem and the chain stretching just baffels me. braking maybe butt that one is also rare with NO other problems.

[karstman]

LF - a few other questions for you.

Have you ever had your diff covers off?
Have you ever verified that you have the same gears in the front and rear diffs?
Is your front diff locked or welded?

[Mark Hinkley]

Scott,

I wish I had pictures but I don't, We have had a t-case that ran without atf in if for months and the chain was so streched that it had worn right thru the case and was visably hnaging out of the case. The guy who owned it didn't realize it until he put it in 4lo and tried to wheel it. All it did was pop like crazy. It was even a 249 case. I've see way to many of the 231 do some crazy things you would never beleive would happen. They are incrediable what they can have happen to them and still keep working - kinda of. Just a note: even when you have a chain out that is stretched it is still hard to see even matching it up to a new one side by side.

I understand it's hard to beleive, but don't worry your not the only one, Blaine thinks I'm full of sh!t on this one also.

mark
orgs mfg

ps. I really don't smoke crack, but all the smoke from welding so much might be getting to me.

[LeadFoot]

Originally posted by karstman
LF - a few other questions for you.

Have you ever had your diff covers off?
Have you ever verified that you have the same gears in the front and rear diffs?
Is your front diff locked or welded?

Yep, I had them both off, to change fluid. All gear teeth looked just fine. Both are open differentials. I still don't know what came from the factory with the 87 6 cyc 5 spd, 3.54 or 3.73's? I don't think the guy before me would re-gear, or at least I hope he didnt.

[Scott Hill]

Well Mark you have me on the 249 never had one in my hands.


I still think any chain in a 231 that is toasted was caused by other problems if you ever run accross one keep it I want to see it. we can pull the master pin to compare length.

I know they stretch but I don't think there is room for it to slip off a tooth with no other problems going on to toast it maybe jusp a tooth or two but I would put my money on rear case bearing at that point.

and the whole drop the crack pipe is about the only thing on this board you can type and not be to offensive.


Scott

[Cement_guy]

[LeadFoot]

Man, remote linking forbidden? Thats dumb. Gotta get a new web host. Is there any that allow remote linking? I might try to set up a webshots account, although they dont allow it.

[LeadFoot]

http://community.webshots.com/user/leadfoot87

There, those pics should work.

[LeadFoot]

Newbie question time.

Do I pull the T-case boot to adjust the linkage, or is that done under the Jeep? is it nessesary to drop the cross member to adjust it? Thanks!

[Scott Hill]

On a YJ I dont know you could just grab it and slide all the way to the rear should be 4 lo on a TJ there is a 13mm nut that holds the shift bar in place in a box shaped retainer the connects to the handle.

I never had to remove the skid but a flashlight may help.


Scott

[donjr5]

Still sounds to me like (not the t-case) but either the rolling diameter of the tires (front-to-rear) or axle gear ratios (front-to-rear) don't match. If a Jeep has been so poorly maintained that the chain is stretched, other parts of the Jeep would show the same effects (poor maintenance). Chains don't stretch from use, but from heat and lack of lubrication.