MT/R's = good stuff

[ChrisO]

I was looking at my new-worn-out Goodyear MT/R's (37's), the other day and was crying about how the tread depth has gone down so rapidly and that the rounded edges are no longer sharp.

They have less then 800 miles on them and I was pitching a fit to a buddy, who was in the shop bench-racing with me. He then said, "well, you do have a few wheelin trips on them, don't you?"

I said, well, a few. Then I started thinking about it and by gosh, he is right. I sat down and figured it out and I take back anything negitive I said about the tires. Here is the trips I have abused them on, since August:

Iron Chest
Battlement Mesa
Die-Trying
Cactus Ridge
Liberty
Patroit
Freedom
Carnage Canyon
Holy Cross
Rusty Nail
Golden Spike
Pritchet Canyon
21 Road

And several "test-romps" around my property. They have no sidewall gashes and have met every expectation I had for them. I highly recommend them.

[bart]

I thought everybody on this board already agreed with that. Seriously, as I stated in another thread earlier today; my MTRs are the best daily driver/off road tire I have ever seen. Oh, and without thier sharp edges are they still hooking up??

How is your 30 holding up? Any things you wish you had dome different with your 8.8?

-Bart

[Allen]

I'm starting to hear that these things don't suck in the mud as bad as some would like you to believe.....that they just need a healthy dose of throttle to get them to self clean.....?

Allen

[cbassett]

BS! You may as well have gatorbacks on your jeep in the mud. The MTRs are slicks in goo >2" deep, anyone saying otherwise is delusional.

[02_WHITE_TJ_X]

Originally posted by Allen
I'm starting to hear that these things don't suck in the mud as bad as some would like you to believe.....that they just need a healthy dose of throttle to get them to self clean.....?

Allen

When I was at slade Ky I taked to 2 people that have or that have had MTR's they both said the same thing " For the type of wheeling we do in the Mid-West - East Coast South-East "MTR's suck"". I really couldn't belive it when I heard it but thats there comments. One of my good freinds had them on his stock Rubi and went to TRXUS he hates both tires and is going back th BFG MT's. The other guy is dumping his MTR's and going to BFG MT's I'm dumping my SSR's and going back to BFG MT's do you see a pattern for the type of wheeling we do around here in OH, IN, PA, KY, NC Yes the side wall are thin with the BFG's but they work around here and wear like iron.

Edit I just remember there was another Rubi on that trip with BFG MT's they made the switch also.

[mrblaine]

Originally posted by cbassett
BS! You may as well have gatorbacks on your jeep in the mud. The MTRs are slicks in goo >2" deep, anyone saying otherwise is delusional.

I'm delusional.

There are two other folks on this board that assisted the folks down in the Escondido area with a midnight mud rescue. Jerry Bransford, Sergey, and myself went down to retrieve a TJ and a Grand that were sitting on the door sills in mud. Not just any mud, that sticky clay crap that is like concrete when it dries.

They can chime in with what they saw, but I yanked the Grand out and then climbed back out of the little valley they were in the bottom of and occasionally had to romp the throttle to clear the mud out, but otherwise, made it just fine.

An idea of how much mud there was. At the car wash the stucks kindly fed quarters in to clean our rigs up. After 75.00 bucks worth, they ran out of money and we were almost clean. Not quite though.

Don't take this as a hearty mud recommendation, but if they were as bad as everyone makes them out to be, I figure as sticky as that mud was, I'd have been there 'til it dried.

Two things that stick out clear as day about that night. One was the failed attempt by Jerry to get down the offcamber mud road and after I winched him up when he almost went over the side into the tree- he turns to me and asks if my rig is my daily driver.

I told him that even if it wasn't, I was still as fond of mine as he was of his.

The second was watching Jerry take a step on a slightly sloped section and go mud surfing for about 20 feet nearly out of control, but upright nonetheless.

[02_WHITE_TJ_X]

Originally posted by mrblaine

mud surfing

You people in CA have all the fun

[bart]

Originally posted by cbassett
BS! You may as well have gatorbacks on your jeep in the mud. The MTRs are slicks in goo >2" deep, anyone saying otherwise is delusional.

I would not trade my MTRs for BFG MT/kms. I might try the Krawlers, but I think they would have no where near the mileage of an MTR. They are decent in mud. My Claws were better and other mud tires similar. I don't like mud, but it is a necessity around here. Even when half packed, MTRs still wrap around and grip rocks very well.

I am very interested in hearing how the IROKs fare long term and seeing what people think of Krawlers when the price comes down.

-Bart

[KJP98TJ]

just not sure how they would do in this stuff:


those are our "rocks" covered in moss, water, mud, leaves, dead trees, etc. pretty typical of the trails we frequent. not to mention our trails are mountains, and not valleys.

i have yet to run with or with anyone with MTR's. so i try to be as objectionable as i can. i know AT's don't work. i know TSL radials fare better. and i know i get owned by bias ply swampers. i realize this doesn't pertain to 90% of the board here. just sharing i guess.

[Darrell C]

Originally posted by 02_WHITE_TJ_X
...Yes the side wall are thin with the BFG's but they work around here and wear like iron.

Maybe I'm misinformed, or there's more to it, but I thought both MTRs and BFG MTs had three-ply sidewalls??

[TObject]

The toilet paper I use is 2-ply. If I fold a sheet on itself, will it be tougher than MTR?

[William]

Originally posted by TObject
The toilet paper I use is 2-ply. If I fold a sheet on itself, will it be tougher than MTR?

Have you tried to wipe your ass with a MTR yet?

WAIT. Don't tell me.

[Ace!]

When it comes to mud, buy a mud tire. AT tires do not do well in mud, comparitively. Also, MTRs, whether you call them an AT or a rock-tire, or whatever, do not do well in mud, comparitively. At least half of the wheeling done in So. Oregon involves mud; from 1? slicker than snot stuff, to mud holes that are hood deep. I ran BFG ATs for a while, and wheeled with more than one person with MTRs. The last guy that had MTRs had them on his Rubi. We spent all day trying to find a place where the MTRs wouldn?t pack up and let him slide forward, backward, and sideways (they can be scary off camber). He almost immediately (after several embarassing situations) bought BFG MTs, then Swampers.

Allen, if you?re considering buying tires and will run in the mud (more than once or twice), you?ll save yourself heartache if you buy something other than ATs/MTRs, and buy some *real* mud tires.

KJP98TJ, that's more like the terrain we have, more so than the JV rocks anyway. I've found similar in what works and doesn't.

[Darrell C]

Originally posted by TObject
The toilet paper I use is 2-ply. If I fold a sheet on itself, will it be tougher than MTR?

Guess that depends on what the plys are made out of

[bart]

Originally posted by KJP98TJ
just not sure how they would do in this stuff:


those are our "rocks" covered in moss, water, mud, leaves, dead trees, etc. pretty typical of the trails we frequent. not to mention our trails are mountains, and not valleys.

i have yet to run with or with anyone with MTR's. so i try to be as objectionable as i can. i know AT's don't work. i know TSL radials fare better. and i know i get owned by bias ply swampers. i realize this doesn't pertain to 90% of the board here. just sharing i guess.

A lot of my wheeling looks similar to that. Maybe bigger rocks, less moss, as much mud and water. I am not sure exactly what it is, but the MTRs seem stickier than my Claws or Bogger or bias TSLs or SXs that I have wheeled with on dirty rocks.

I am trying to attach and 85k (640x480) image off my hard drive - it says it's too big?

-Bart

[Iceman]

Originally posted by Darrell C
Maybe I'm misinformed, or there's more to it, but I thought both MTRs and BFG MTs had three-ply sidewalls??

go to a tire shop and feel/see the difference. That'll explain why, in the same given circumstances and rig set ups, more BFG MT's rip than MT/R's.

I'm on the MT/R band wagon as well, since it just plain is the best tire for my type of wheeling in the Southwest. Just an occasional mud hole and sometimes the clay kinda goo when it rains in the creekbeds. And even though the MT/R's are not a mud tire they do just fine on those occasions where they have to, hence the fact that with the tires sticking out the mud slings all over the Heep
And the car wash is both happy (many quarters) and un-happy (lotsa mud and goo) after our clean ups

[BlueJeeper]

Meh.

BFG MT. Incrementalist tire of choice.

Increased driver ability > incremental difference gained going from aggressive AT or MTR to BFG MT in mud.

[ChrisO]

Originally posted by bart
Oh, and without thier sharp edges are they still hooking up??

How is your 30 holding up? Any things you wish you had dome different with your 8.8? Bart

Yep, still hooking up, just rounded. I'm spoiled though. I like new sharp edges. I'll flip them from side to side and run them for another dozen runs, then sell them to some youngn'.

I'm still amazed that the good ole 30 is hackin'. There was more then once that I hade to really romp on it. However, I do not let if bounce really hard, at full throttle (just 3/4). I thought for sure something would go "ka-blam-ee", but no, it hacked. I've inspected everything and no twisted shafts, no teeth missing, no chunks of anykind............yet . And I'm running 297's!

Same story with the space-ship looking F8.8. Hacking great. I love the clearance and find myself aiming for rocks, just to see if I can clear it, and most of the time I do. If I hit something, it slides over instead of stopping like a plow. The under side looks like a battlefield though.

The rear coils and links are great too. Works way better then leafs, no bouncing or wheel-hop. Just tire smoke, and now I come full circle on this post. Really happy with the 37's.

I hate mud and didn't buy them for a mud tire. If I had to run in the mud, I'd move.

[sethmark]

Originally posted by Iceman
go to a tire shop and feel/see the difference. That'll explain why, in the same given circumstances and rig set ups, more BFG MT's rip than MT/R's.

Umm... you wish.


The difference between the MT/R and the BFG is in the construction. The MT/R is a modified radial. It uses a 87* (if memory serves) radial thread pattern that criss crosses the threads so that when they're punctured, they don't tear all the way up the tire like a traditional radial.

[Jerry Bransford]

Originally posted by mrblaine
I'm delusional.

There are two other folks on this board that assisted the folks down in the Escondido area with a midnight mud rescue. Jerry Bransford, Sergey, and myself went down to retrieve a TJ and a Grand that were sitting on the door sills in mud. Not just any mud, that sticky clay crap that is like concrete when it dries.

They can chime in with what they saw, but I yanked the Grand out and then climbed back out of the little valley they were in the bottom of and occasionally had to romp the throttle to clear the mud out, but otherwise, made it just fine.

An idea of how much mud there was. At the car wash the stucks kindly fed quarters in to clean our rigs up. After 75.00 bucks worth, they ran out of money and we were almost clean. Not quite though.

Don't take this as a hearty mud recommendation, but if they were as bad as everyone makes them out to be, I figure as sticky as that mud was, I'd have been there 'til it dried.

Two things that stick out clear as day about that night. One was the failed attempt by Jerry to get down the offcamber mud road and after I winched him up when he almost went over the side into the tree- he turns to me and asks if my rig is my daily driver.

I told him that even if it wasn't, I was still as fond of mine as he was of his.

The second was watching Jerry take a step on a slightly sloped section and go mud surfing for about 20 feet nearly out of control, but upright nonetheless.

That was a heck of a fun night, wasn't it Blaine! And the steep off-camber road I couldn't get down that Blaine mentioned? Right after I tried and almost slid off over the edge, Blaine launched his Jeep down the same muddy trail and more or less skiied and slid his Jeep down, sliding sideways much of the way into the canyon where the TJ and Grand were stuck... an impressive but scary piece of driving if I ever saw it!

[JMyerz]

I like Thornbirds

[Scott]

Originally posted by sethmark
Umm... you wish.


The difference between the MT/R and the BFG is in the construction. The MT/R is a modified radial. It uses a 87* (if memory serves) radial thread pattern that criss crosses the threads so that when they're punctured, they don't tear all the way up the tire like a traditional radial.

Interesting philosiphy Seth. Makes sense... but it also seems to me that whatever brand tire you happen to be running at the time, is the best thing since sliced bread... You ran swampers, loved them, then complained that they wouldn't balance.. then you ran MTR's loved them.. now you are running BFG's and think they are the best... Are you gonna make up your mind one of these days?
Scott

[sethmark]

Originally posted by Scott
Interesting philosiphy Seth. Makes sense... but it also seems to me that whatever brand tire you happen to be running at the time, is the best thing since sliced bread... You ran swampers, loved them, then complained that they wouldn't balance.. then you ran MTR's loved them.. now you are running BFG's and think they are the best... Are you gonna make up your mind one of these days?
Scott

Do you read the entire threads? We're discussing the regular old BFG MT. Radial. Radial tires rip amazingly in a RADIAL pattern. The MT/R DOESN'T, because it can't. The cords overlap. If you REALLY knew your stuff, you'd know that what makes the SX so tough is not only the number and thickness of the plys, and the denier of the cord, but also the bias construction which puts the cord at a 45* angle and REALLY prevents tears and punctures.

What really chafes your chaps is that I get to talk about this stuff first hand, while you get to guess what it'd be like to know the difference.

Seth (would go back to the MT/R tomorrow if I had to. Very good tire for my wheelin'. Swampers? Probably would go back to them to, if I didn't want to maintain streetability. )

[Scott]

Originally posted by sethmark
Do you read the entire threads? We're discussing the regular old BFG MT. Radial. Radial tires rip amazingly in a RADIAL pattern. The MT/R DOESN'T, because it can't. The cords overlap.

What really chafes your chaps is that I get to talk about this stuff first hand, while you get to guess what it'd be like to know the difference.

Seth (would go back to the MT/R tomorrow if I had to. Very good tire for my wheelin'. Swampers? Probably would go back to them to, if I didn't want to maintain streetability. )

Seth, I read it, and knew exactly which tires you were talking about.. I agreed... I told you it made sense. Which it does. And you are right.. I never tore a sidewall on my old style BFG's, nor have I torn a sidewall on my MTR's, but I do know that the MTR's have lasted me a lot longer than the BFG's did...

I think what really chafes your chaps, as you put it, is you know that Im right about the way you compare tires...
Just my opinion..
Scott

[sethmark]

Actually, I think that most everyone who's close to me would know that I'm VERY open and honest about the the stuff I've ****ed money away on and the stuff I like.

The swampers pretty much sucked from the get go. The were really expensive (over $220 a tire) and didn't work well anywhere. Tried like hell to make them go, but they didn't hook up in the rocks no matter what the air pressure. Now I've seen swampers work in JV, but not on my jeep.

The MT/R, I've never had a foul word for. They are a wonderful all purpose tire. I put 17000 miles on them and tons of wheelin and they were damn near perfect. (can't really fault a tire that says 'not for highway use' for popping on the highway)

But, it just so happens that I got a set of something that has proven to be extremely sticky and very reliable off road. The road manners of the Krawler aren't particularly good. They're noisy, they flat spot, and aren't gonna last forever, but they're damn good off road.

Now. With that information, I can say: 1. The swamper was ok, but didn't work for me. 2. The MT/R was great and I loved it.
3. The Krawler is even better and I really, really love it.

[Scott]

Ok, well.. before, you said this:

Swampers? Probably would go back to them to, if I didn't want to maintain streetability.

Then you continued to say this:

The swampers pretty much sucked from the get go, and didn't work well anywhere

So why would you go back to them, if they sucked? Just trying to clarify a bit, and I thank you for explaining the whole tire choice thing to me, because it wasn't making any sense.
Scott

[bart]

Originally posted by Scott
Interesting philosiphy Seth. Makes sense... but it also seems to me that whatever brand tire you happen to be running at the time, is the best thing since sliced bread... You ran swampers, loved them, then complained that they wouldn't balance.. then you ran MTR's loved them.. now you are running BFG's and think they are the best... Are you gonna make up your mind one of these days?
Scott

From a neutral point of view....... Do you agree that for rocks Krawlers are better than MTRs are better than TSLs? From the wheeling I have done and competition I have seen, this seems to be true. Kudos to Seth for being able to upgrade to the latest and greatest.

I think you really have to groove TSLs or SXs to get close to MTR stickiness on the rocks. Krawlers stick great, but high cost and low mileage will keep me from "upgrading" to them for a while.

-Bart

[bart]

Oh, and I do agree that Interco quality control is not nearly as good as any of the big names (this accounts for the roundness and balancing issues some people have).

[sethmark]

Scott,
I say that they didn't work for me because the set I had didn't. I say I would go back to them if I had to, because I've seen them work well on other rigs. Remember, this is hypothetical. I don't have to, nor will I need to go back to Swampers.

As for the Krawlers, I think that they are an excellent rockcrawling tire. I think that the MT/R also is an excellent tire, but its proven to be 2 year old technology in the rockcrawling world. Doesn't make it bad, just not the hottest, latest and greatest thing in the world.

I just happen to have one of those jobs where getting the latest and greatest is easy and accessible. I do nothing but think about Jeep stuff all day long, anyhow, so I do get lots of ideas and act on as many of them as I can.

This isn't about me though. Its about the MT/R being an excellent all around tire.

[William]

Originally posted by sethmark
Its about the MT/R being an excellent all around tire.

I hate arguements about tires because everyone's got a valid point and everyone wants to defend what they spend money on and so on.

I'm not gonna bag on swampers, because they work for some people.. Nor the new BFG.. because they work for some people.

I will say that MTR's have done well for me, and wear well on the street. I wheel on rocks (Big bear, Anza) and loose dirt (the TDS area) and sometimes other stuff. I bought them for wheeling, and the street wear is a side benefit. I was told they wore well on the street, and it was my hope they would, but I didn't want to rely on it. My only street compliant is when it rains, I get tail wag sometimes. However, it's suspect that it may be a result of my suspension issues.

I think that people need to consider that there is no perfect tire, and that even their own tire of choice will have limitations in certain arena's.

As to people saying that MTR's suck in mud, I would want to agree, however, I had an experience on the rubicon that proved thier capability to me. Despite serval people warning me.. it was dark and I hit a patch of pumpkin deep mud. With no high power run, I simply got in, and rolled through it. I locked up the lockers, and slowly drove forward.. and rolled right throught. It was some gumbo mud too. If you look closely in the picture.. You can see that it was up to the front bumper at the dip.