A twisted tale of TeraFlex...What will they do now?

[Jim M]

The following is a copy of an email I just sent to Tera about my Tera Low 231. For the record, I believe that you get more bees with honey, so I am always very polite and understanding when on the phone with any company and dealing with issues. I'm even polite to telemarketers. The ending to this story has yet to be written Tera has the pen at this point and is in control of the outcome. If they fail me again, you can read about it on every electronic bulletin board from here to the moon. I will also change my tags to read, "Tera Sux". I have not and will not threaten them, and have only posted about this here.
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To whom it may concern,

I purchased the TeraFlex Low 231 transfer case kit for my 97 TJ. The purchase was made based upon good reports of product quality and customer service on the part of TeraFlex. Sadly, I have put both to the test and both have failed miserably.

I assembled the case per the instructions and found that the drive chain would make contact with the shift ring when 4 wd was engaged. I spoke to Chad in customer service about this and sent photo to document the instance. I was instructed to return the case to Tera and did so. The case was sent on January 28th. It was received at Tera on February 5th. The problem was found to be a faulty assembly of the case. The case was to be returned to me via three day shipping to ensure receipt before the weekend of February 16-17. Through a miscommunication within Tera the case was sent to my home address instead of my work address. It was also sent with a signature requirement. The result was that the case was not delivered until Monday February 18th. I called Chad who apologized and refunded my payment of extra shipping charges. Upon receipt of the case on February 18th I discovered it was shipped without the planetary assembly installed. The case had to be returned to Tera yet again. A call tag was issued and the case was picked up on February 20th. It was received for the second time at Tera on February 27th. After a lengthy wait with no news of what was going on I called for a status update. Jim answered the phone and explained that the case was sent to be checked for a faulty milling of the shift detent hole. I accepted the explanation and asked that the case be returned to me before this weekend. Jim assured me that he would take care of this personally. He called later in the day to inform me that the case was on its way to me via three day delivery and I would have it by the weekend. The case arrived earlier today. I was happy to finally have the case back and looking forward to installing it. To date the case has not been in my TJ as it is in a near constant state of shipping.

I am once again disappointed. Upon partially assembling the case again, I found it does indeed have the milling problem affecting the detent hole. I find it deplorable that I have waited for so long to have a part that retails for almost $1000 to be sent to me in working order. I have been without the use of my money and without the product for 37 days to date, and now there is another problem. This will make the third trip back to Tera, which is unacceptable. I am not unreasonable and have been very polite and understanding, but I have reached the end of my patience. At this point I feel betrayed. I will not be at work on Friday as I took the day off to install my transfer case for a trip next weekend. I will now have wasted a day of vacation, and will still have to take another day off to be able to make my trip. I realize that Tera is not fiscally responsible for these things, but feel that those responsible for making decisions should be aware of how their actions affect the customer.

Upon receipt of this email I expect to be contacted on my cell phone at 410-984-8599. Further, a new unit should be shipped to my home address, priority overnight, Saturday delivery so that I can have what I paid for by this weekend. The old unit can be picked up via a call tag next week. If for some reason this is not possible, I would like to hear from the owner as to why my satisfaction on a $1000 product has no meaning to TeraFlex.

Jim McCabe
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Anyone wanna guess what they will do?

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97 TJ. Not stock.

It's only a 4 cylinder...wait up!

[mrblaine]

Jim, one of the reasons I have been hoping for a "bolt-on" stock suspension class in competition, is to get better products out to the customer. Along with better products should come better customer service.

As of now, no suspension supplier is without some major performance quirk in their kits. Either longevity, flex, damage to stock componentry, or just downright dismal performance.

I truly feel a BO stock class would make them step up to the plate and start delivering a better class of products to the customer.

As for your situation, it's pretty much a crapshoot.

Robert lucked out in having his installed by a reputable shop who had to replace his a couple of times I think, I know it was at least once. Had Robert been on the hook for the whole thing, he may have been on a plane to UT with some napalm.

It is impossible to ascertain the value of something until you have paid for it a few times.

[TJRON]

My choice is not listed:
They will attempt tp baffle you with bull****......
Ron

I like the way my Jeep is now..... I'd just like it, well, a little higher off the ground with more ground clearance!

[mbryson]

I could have Brent weld their shop doors shut so they can only work.

Be careful with the napalm. I don't think my insurance will cover damage by napalm, then I'll have to find someone to ride with instead of drive my station wagon around.

Upcountry XJ

[Jim M]

I heard from DC Peters, the dealer I bought the part through. He has contacted Tera on my behalf as the selling dealer and is escalating the problem. He also said that as of two days ago Tera had no Low 231's in stock ready to ship. It is also his position that my case should have simply been replaced the first time without trying to fix it, and that I shouldn't have paid shipping even the first time. We'll see how much pull a Tera dealer really has.

I do have to put in a good word for DC's 4 Wheel parts in Virginia. He had good pricing, prompt service and now that he is aware of my problem is getting personally involved. It's nice to deal with someone who would jeopardize their relationship with their vendors to stand up for their customers. Service like that is rare, and he has definitely been bumped up to the first call I make when buying parts. I will also post his praises on the other bulletin boards I frequent.

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97 TJ. Not stock.

It's only a 4 cylinder...wait up!

[mrblaine]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mbryson:
I could have Brent weld their shop doors shut so they can only work.

Be careful with the napalm. I don't think my insurance will cover damage by napalm, then I'll have to find someone to ride with instead of drive my station wagon around.

Upcountry XJ[/quote]

I am going to assume you have a close relationship with Tera by your response. I hope you understood that it was a Tongue in Cheek reference to the amount of frustration Robert was feeling and not really ever a possibility. I left out a few thousand winkies, so my intent may have been misconstrued. I apologize if so.

It is impossible to ascertain the value of something until you have paid for it a few times.

[mbeshears]

I purchased a 231 Tera Low about three and a half years ago and had the same problem. I received the parts, and spent Friday installing them. The fit was not right, and I called Terra. They explained I was not installing it correctly. I spent the next two day's going over it trying to determine what was wrong. On Monday, I called again, this time they said that they had a bad shipment of case halves. Yes, the hole for the shifting mechanism was improperly machined. After explaining my position, ie: my time, frustration, etc., they sent a new case, a call tag, and paid a locall shop to install it. It did take about 10 days to resolve, but I was satisfied. I find it curious though, that they are still having a similar problem

[Robert J. Yates]

My Teralow exploded on a trip back from Arizona. Essentially, there is a freeze plug in the main shaft which in my case, was not installed correctly and that allowed the automatic to evacuate the ATF out of the t-case, essentially overfilling the automatic. I had to stop every 75-100 miles or so (on a 500 mile trip) and refill the t-case. That made for a really long drive.

As Blaine mentioned, I had a shop install mine and I am certainly glad that I did. When I got the Jeep back to LA, the shop basically swapped me a complete new unit and then dealt with Tera themselves. I was back on the road in one day without having to hassle with Tera. From what I understand, although it took about 6 months, the shop eventually was refunded both the material and the additional labor they were out from having to do the install twice. To the credit of the Teralow, I have never had a problem with the second unit (knock on wood). I have however, recently had to do a complete seal replacement on my automatic. My take is that the Teralow problem of overfilling the thing lead to premature seal failure. While I can't prove it, I have no other way to explain why a perfectly good and well functioning automatic that has been regularly serviced would lunch all of its seals.

Furthering the Teralow's interesting reputation, I have a friend who had Currie install one of these units into his Jeep which also ended up needing to be replaced. It seems that the case was not cast correctly and the ATF was actually weeping out of the case and not any of the seals.

I voted that Tera will probably not make things easy for you but they will eventually take care of it. Personally, I would not put another one of these units in my Jeep. It is certainly not needed with an automatic (if you have the correct axle gearing) and its not what I would call a model of production consistency. If I were in your situation, I would be trying to get my money back and stick with the stock 231 until I could upgrade to an Atlas.

FWIW, I would never napalm the Tera offices but thats not to say that its an exceedingly difficult company to deal with. I went through the same shenanigans with my front trackbar. Bob Supplee was the only saving grace there as he overnighted a RE bar to me so Tera's shipping my crap around didn't affect me. Oh yea, their arms also suck

98 TJ Sport
D44ARB/D30Detroit/Teralow/35" MTr's

[Jim M]

Robert, thanks for sharing your experience.

I'd like to address you comment about the need for the Tera unit, saving for an Atlas, and getting my money back. A few hours ago I was on the phone with another member of this board. He and I were discussing, among other things, the limited market for putting low gears into a TJ. The choices right now are Tera Low, Atlas, and D300 flipped with Tera Low gears. I have a four cylinder stick with 35 inch tires. In my application the Atlas is overkill, and overpriced to match. Stock gearing is not adequate for any serious off road driving with the little motor and big tires. Even with my 4.88's it's too fast. The Dana 300 solution still relies on Tera for low gearing. If there were a medium priced transfer case, with low gearing that were a bolt in and incorporated a fixed front and rear yoke we both felt there would be a market for such a product. As of today it doesn't exist.

A few minutes ago I got off the phone with Tera and they first tried to tell me I was installing things improperly. That went over like a lead balloon as I have been inside a the 231 case on many occasions and am a competent mechanic. The next shot was taken at the old parts being worn. They implied that I should be using new parts. Does it make sense to buy a Tera Low and then replace the components with all new parts? The cost would exceed that of the Atlas. Further, I have three transfer cases, one is in the TJ working fine, the other two are for spares and I tried parts from both cases. Neither worked. He then asked that I return the case to be fixed and sent back to me. That idea didn't go over too well with me either. I remained calm, as I always do when trying to resolve differences, and insisted that a replacement be overnighted at their expense. I was then transferred to another rep who agreed and is shipping a new unit to me to be here on my door step tomorrow. This is not over as the new case isn't here yet. I will assemble the replacement case tomorrow and see how that goes.

Thanks for the replies. I appreciate this board for its candor and close knit feel even though I'm thousands of miles from most of you. My cell number is published above, fell free to call it if you would like to talk. Just remember, I'm 3 hours ahead of most of you.

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97 TJ. Not stock.

It's only a 4 cylinder...wait up!

[brent]

MrBlane and others, yes we do live within walking distance, kinda long walk, but walkable. and I've had no good experiances with terra or their junk. the only product I'd ever buy from them is an empty terra rc60 housing.

as for the terra low, I heard they quit making them cause it was a bad design, four wheel of moab quit puttin them in cause they were all junk, I'm sure others have the same problem,

sad thing is it may have not been cheaper to get an atlas, but by the time your all said and done, you'll wish you had.

[brent]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jim M:
I would like to hear from the owner as to why my satisfaction on a $1000 product has no meaning to TeraFlex.

Jim McCabe
[/quote]

sad thing is, from my experiance, it don't meen jack.

I'm just glad I'm close enough I can take it back and, show them where to put it.

[Robert J. Yates]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jim M:
Robert, thanks for sharing your experience.

I'd like to address you comment about the need for the Tera unit, saving for an Atlas, and getting my money back. A few hours ago I was on the phone with another member of this board. He and I were discussing, among other things, the limited market for putting low gears into a TJ. The choices right now are Tera Low, Atlas, and D300 flipped with Tera Low gears. I have a four cylinder stick with 35 inch tires. In my application the Atlas is overkill, and overpriced to match. Stock gearing is not adequate for any serious off road driving with the little motor and big tires. Even with my 4.88's it's too fast. The Dana 300 solution still relies on Tera for low gearing. If there were a medium priced transfer case, with low gearing that were a bolt in and incorporated a fixed front and rear yoke we both felt there would be a market for such a product. As of today it doesn't exist.
[/quote]

No problem - glad to share and thats one of the big reasons why we created this place.

As to your comment about a t-case that gives you the low range you need - notice I said that it wasn't needed but qualified that by stating that correct axle gearing was needed. I still hold to that with the automatic but your comment got me to thinking. ( dangerous I know )

Why do you need a 5-speed? Have you considered swapping in a SM variety 4-speed with the 6-7:1 first gear? With 4:88's in your diffs and 35's, you most likely have pretty good highway manners but how often do you really use 5th? Seems that a lower first geared 4-speed tranny would probably work just as well as a Teralow or Atlas. SM's are pretty easy to find and not to expensive. Its also much more stout than the tranny you are running now. You could even consider a NV as a solution as well but thats big bucks. I think you might be able to skip the entire t-case issue with some creative problem solving and some decision making on your driving habits with the Jeep.

98 TJ Sport
D44ARB/D30Detroit/Teralow/35" MTr's

[Jim M]

Robert,

Truth is I would rather have an auto. I have given serious thought to a swap, but haven't put any research into it yet. I got the Tera Low at a quite reasonable price and figured I would sell it later after the auto swap. Later hasn't arrived yet and I'm currently devoting my resources to the suspension. Once I'm happy with it, I will begin researching in earnest the auto swap.

I am however intrigued by your comments. Care to elaborate and maybe share some of your knowledge? My driving habits aren't really habits, but are dictated by the role of the Jeep as a daily driver. I am a computer consultant and am required to be on several different sites, often in the same day, in different cities. Even my full time job as an IS Manager requires that I support two sites. Until I purchase another daily driver, the TJ will need good road manners. If I were to complete the swap before the TJ becomes a trailered vehicle one of my goals would be to have a tolerable highway ride, which means 3000 RPM in top gear at about 70-75 mph. That puts the top gear at about .85 or so, which is where I'm at now. The second goal is a low enough gear to actually keep up with traffic around town, which is about 4 or so (I'm at 3.93 now). The ratios of the AX-5 are just about perfect, but a little lower on the top would be fine(I usually cruise at 65 mph, but occasionally do 75 downhill), and deeper on the bottom is always welcome. To me that means a four speed auto. I would have to find one that can be mated to the four cylinder. I can move the engine forward, but it looks like much more than about three inches requires the harness to be spliced for the added length. Moving the transfer case rearward is not an option as I will have a flat skid the raises the mounts nearly three inches. The drive shaft angle would get fairly sttep with the low pinion 44 that's in there. The shifter may also need to be cable actuated to be fit between the tub and transmission depending where the various drive line parts end up.

Brent,

I can appreciate the comment about wishing for the Atlas, however that's not me. It's overkill, hard to fit into my application and just too expensive to justify behind a four cylinder. True that I would own it for a long time and through many vehicles perhaps, but at this time it's not on my wish list. If I won one at a raffle, I would sell it. I like the design and it's a great product, just not for me. Twin sticks would be very handy on the trail though... The Tera Low fits my goals better; I just wish there were more options out there, or that a better company would market a similar product.

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97 TJ. Not stock.

It's only a 4 cylinder...wait up!

[brent]

clune v crawler, put it inbetween the tranny and t case, comes in 2.72 and 4 to one. kinda hard if you have a swb tho, its about 6-7" long.

[Robert J. Yates]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by brent:
clune v crawler, put it inbetween the tranny and t case, comes in 2.72 and 4 to one. kinda hard if you have a swb tho, its about 6-7" long.[/quote]

Yea, but with the 4 banger, he can move the motor forward and accomodate the Klune box without compromising the driveshaft.

Jim, I don't have any real experience with swapping in a 4 speed stick. I know some guys who run them in older Jeeps and they seem to hold up very well and provide a reasonable crawl when coupled with a Dana300 and V8 power. As for how all that would work in your sitch being a daily driver and all, I think that maybe a NV would be a better bet. Then again, you are talking about bucks. The NV, Klune box and Atlas are all about the same pricewise and come with their own set of fabrication issues. An auto would probably be just as much of a PITA to you as any one of those options especially in rigging rig up the 4-speed from a Cherokee - something I have not heard of being done on a 4 banger.

Frankly, needing 75 on the freeway might be something you need to look at losing if you are looking at getting better trail performance. But coming from the perspective of daily driver and freeway performance, I can see why the Teralow sounds appealing to you. It was the same way with me when I went for mine. I have since changed my mind about it though.

98 TJ Sport
D44ARB/D30Detroit/Teralow/35" MTr's

[Jim M]

Brent,

I can move the engine forward, but as I mentioned earlier the harness only has about three inches of slack in it. Splicing would be tedious, but very do-able. The issue I then face is how to adapt the transmission linkage. With everything pushed up into the body from the lifted skid there isn't much room to work with.

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97 TJ. Not stock.

It's only a 4 cylinder...wait up!

Jim:
Jason at Tri County Gear is doing that 4 cyl., 231, Klune with enertia ring deal on a regular basis. (909) 623-3373
Garry

[Jim M]

Well, I got the replacement case os promised. It's a brand new 23 spline unit all ready to be built and bolted in. Remind me again what the spline count is on the AX-5 transmission? I'll give you a hint: it's not 23...

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97 TJ. Not stock.

It's only a 4 cylinder...wait up!

[TJRON]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TJRON:
My choice is not listed:
They will attempt tp baffle you with bull****......
Ron

[/quote]

This reminds me of some dealings I had with Drive Train Direct. 6 months later they sold me a D44 OX for $450 to make it up to me. I hope something good comes from this BS for you.
I feel your pain.
Ron

I like the way my Jeep is now..... I'd just like it, well, a little higher off the ground with more ground clearance!