Clicking noise in front end

[DanB98TJ]

Fred and I did a little wheeling yesterday - snorkeling is more like it - and towards the end of the trail I started hearing a clicking noise from the front end. Doesn't do it all the time, and the best we were able to track it down was to the left front wheel area, axle shaft, or something around the front diff. The clicks are about the same speed as the driveshaft rotation, and seem to start after making a tight turn, especially to the right, but will also do it going straight. After I got home I drove it around in circles and couldn't get it to make the noise again.

I haven't pulled the front cover off yet, but checked the fluid and it looked fine and there was no metal on the magnet. The axleshaft looks okay, but I do have a couple U-joints turning in the yoke...need a new set of shafts. There is no play in the pinion, but there is some slop in the driveshaft slip yoke.

Before I start pulling the whole $!#@$ axle apart, anyone have specific things to check?

[mrblaine]

Originally posted by DanB98TJ
Fred and I did a little wheeling yesterday - snorkeling is more like it - and towards the end of the trail I started hearing a clicking noise from the front end. Doesn't do it all the time, and the best we were able to track it down was to the left front wheel area, axle shaft, or something around the front diff. The clicks are about the same speed as the driveshaft rotation, and seem to start after making a tight turn, especially to the right, but will also do it going straight. After I got home I drove it around in circles and couldn't get it to make the noise again.

I haven't pulled the front cover off yet, but checked the fluid and it looked fine and there was no metal on the magnet. The axleshaft looks okay, but I do have a couple U-joints turning in the yoke...need a new set of shafts. There is no play in the pinion, but there is some slop in the driveshaft slip yoke.

Before I start pulling the whole $!#@$ axle apart, anyone have specific things to check?

Sounds like you warped a front rotor and it's making the pads pop back and forth.

Get it to make the noise and lightly apply the brakes. If it goes away, it's something to do with the brake pads.

[DanB98TJ]

I'm pretty sure it was doing it with the brakes on, but if I can get it to start again I'll give that a shot.

The speed of the clicking is a lot faster than wheel speed - when at walking speed it was clicking pretty fast.

[Darrell C]

Dan,

You might have a u-joint cap that slipped out a bit, and the u-joint yoke is walking back and forth with driveshaft rotation.

[DanB98TJ]

I'll take a look at that - unless I can get it to make the noise again and pinpoint it better I'll probably have to pull it apart and check things out bit by bit.

Wonder how long I can get by with a new set of U-joints in the old shafts before the ears break....

[DsrtJeeper]

Just curious if you run a Detroit up front as well? My jeep has done this ever since I installed the Lockright. I even replaced front shafts with chromoly units and 760's thinking I had a bad joint. I really notice it when using 4 low holding me back while rolling down a steep grade. Mine only makes noise in 4 WD and I can readily duplicate it on the pavement in 4 Low. Try driving yours in circles on the pavement in 4 Low and High. Does it make the same ticking? Now drive straight in 4WD. Is it gone?

Eric

[Robert J. Yates]

Originally posted by DanB98TJ
Wonder how long I can get by with a new set of U-joints in the old shafts before the ears break....

Get the MIG out and tack the caps Dan - new u-joints are not going to help wallered out yokes. Time to hunt down a hub conversion or Superior kit - thats the only way to rid yourself of the problem.

[DanB98TJ]

Eric - I have Detroits at both ends. While this sounds similar to a locker during turns, it does it going straight, too...or did. All the neighbors probably thought I was crazy(ier) when I was driving around in circles last night.... It was doing it a lot while in 2-low, but I'm pretty sure it was also clicking in 4-low.

Robert - I'd love to have the Warn kit, but it just isn't in the budget for a while. I've been keeping an eye on the Alloy USA shafts but need to check on the prices. For the time being I'll probably just tack some new joints in place to at least eliminate that as a source of the noise.

[DsrtJeeper]

Originally posted by DanB98TJ
Eric - I have Detroits at both ends. While this sounds similar to a locker during turns, it does it going straight, too...or did. All the neighbors probably thought I was crazy(ier) when I was driving around in circles last night.... It was doing it a lot while in 2-low, but I'm pretty sure it was also clicking in 4-low.

Robert - I'd love to have the Warn kit, but it just isn't in the budget for a while. I've been keeping an eye on the Alloy USA shafts but need to check on the prices. For the time being I'll probably just tack some new joints in place to at least eliminate that as a source of the noise.

Dan;
Mine does it while going straight as well. It goes away fairly quick though when doing this.

www.RedRock4x4.com will sell you the Alloy USA fronts for $599.00 shipped to your door. They come with u-joints and everything you'll need. Tell Jason that Eric sent you.

[DanB98TJ]

Just took it out for a fairly long test drive, got the brakes good and hot, did enough circles in the parking lot to make me dizzy...not a #$!@$@ sound now. I'll probably still pull the shafts and swap in some new U-joints, and yank the cover to make sure nothing obvious is wrong...especially after reading Stu's post. )

Instead of spending $600 on the Alloy USA shafts I'd rather put that money towards the Warn kit and inners.

[DsrtJeeper]

Originally posted by DanB98TJ
Just took it out for a fairly long test drive, got the brakes good and hot, did enough circles in the parking lot to make me dizzy...not a #$!@$@ sound now. I'll probably still pull the shafts and swap in some new U-joints, and yank the cover to make sure nothing obvious is wrong...especially after reading Stu's post. )

Instead of spending $600 on the Alloy USA shafts I'd rather put that money towards the Warn kit and inners.

Exactly what I go through! I never know when it will come back. It is most noticeable on the trail in 4x4 though. I've never got it to do it in 2 wheel drive. Keep us informed.

[DanB98TJ]

Well, curiousity and frustration got the best of me, so I pulled the front diff cover off and the axleshafts out. Guess what I found?



















Not a friggin' thing. No bolts loose anywhere in the diff, no broken gears and the pattern looks fine, no chunks of Detroit laying in the bottom. Unit bearings turn nice and smooth. Pulled the driver's side U-joint out, and while one of the caps was a little dry inside none were galled or showed any problems. The caps had turned in the ears of the inner shaft but were still pretty hard to get out. The outer was a real PITA. Figured I'd wait until tomorrow to mess with the passenger side - the neighbors are probably tired of hearing me hammering and cussing....

I guess if there is nothing obvious with the passenger side U-joint I'll just put new joints in and close everything up. When whatever is making the noise breaks I guess I'll know what it was....

I can't imagine the little bit of slop in the driveshaft slip yoke would make that kind of noise, but I may pull it apart and check it out a little closer just to be sure.

[Stu Olson]

Dan.....not sure if I should say congrats or sorry. The good thing is that what is inside your diff is in good shape...and I'm thinking that of all those things that sping and go wir when you are driving, that is a good thing NOT to have to replace (as far as cost is concerned).

[DanB98TJ]

Yeah, I'm happy I haven't found anything wrong - especially nothing expensive - but trying to figure out what is causing the noise is driving me nuts. Between the Jeep and the $#!@$!@$ rattle in the dash of the truck I'm about to go postal....

[Chris L]

I get the same noise sometimes. Kinda like a large ball bearing dropping inside the front left wheel as it turns at low speed. Seems like the clips on the wj brake pads are moving.

[DsrtJeeper]

Blaine's theory on the front brakes has my interest peaked. The only hole in this theory is that mine only does it in 4WD.

[John]

Pull the front driveshaft and try it again. Check the front pinion for slop.
How are the u-joints in the front shaft?

[DanB98TJ]

Chris - That sounds similar to what I'm hearing, but it's evenly spaced and seems to be related to the driveshaft speed. Once I get everything bolted back up I'll set the dial indicator on the rotors to see if they're warped to rule out that possibility.

Originally posted by John
Pull the front driveshaft and try it again. Check the front pinion for slop.
How are the u-joints in the front shaft?

The U-joints in the shaft seem okay, but I'll probably replace the front one while I have the shaft out to check the slip yoke. Doesn't seem to be any unusual slop in the front pinion.

I just picked up some 760x joints for the axleshafts. Any suggestions on where to (or not to) tack weld them? I'm thinking one tack weld on each cap on the inside of the circle (the yoke part, not around the ears). I don't want to weaken them any - they have to last until I can afford new ones.

[TJeeper]

I had a similar problem last year, clicking noise while in 4WD. I pulled the front shaft and took it apart, relubed everything. Didn't see any obvious problems, but the centering ball seemed like it didn't have enough lube around it. Noise went away after re-installing.

[DanB98TJ]

Passenger side U-joint was pretty dry, and one of the posts had some visible marks from where the rollers had worn into it. I kinda doubt that is the source of the noise but it's probably a good thing I replaced them. A couple of the caps had turned here, too, but they were still a major PITA to get out, so hopefully the shafts aren't too bad. Hopefully my rabbit turd tack welds will hold....

TJeeper - I'll give that a shot, too. I'm running Fred's old shaft and I think he had it rebuilt with a greasable CV, so I'll give it a few strokes with the grease gun and keep my fingers crossed.....

Thanks for all the suggestions and tips. Hopefully between all of them it will fix it for good.

[DanB98TJ]

Everything is back together, and with few exceptions everything looked perfect.

Front brake rotors had very little runout (.003" passenger side, driver's side barely moved the needle on the dial indicator).

No metal, chunks of Detroit, broken gears, loose bolts, or anything visible in diff. No slop in the pinion and everything turned nice and smooth.

Front driveshaft U-joint looked good, but replaced it since it was out.

Unit bearings looked and felt fine.

The only things I found were the slip yoke on the front shaft had a little slop, so I pulled it apart, cleaned and greased it. There was some visible wear to the blue teflon coating or whatever the factory put on there, but not down to metal.

The center ball on the front CV looked dry so it was greased.

Both axle U-joints were a little dry. The passenger side axle U-joint had some roller marks one of the posts but I don't know it was bad enough to cause the noise I was hearing. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that something I did will fix it....

Thanks again for all the tips.

[mrblaine]

Originally posted by DanB98TJ


Both axle U-joints were a little dry. The passenger side axle U-joint had some roller marks one of the posts but I don't know it was bad enough to cause the noise I was hearing. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that something I did will fix it....

Thanks again for all the tips.

That's the start of brinnelling. Impressions of the needle bearings worn into the trunnion from driving in straight lines too much. Also another reason you don't set your rear pinion perfectly straight with a CV jointed driveshaft.

No rotation of the joints is a bad thing.

[DsrtJeeper]

That joint looks like you dug it out of a wrecked ship in the middle of the ocean!

That galling of the metal from the needle bearings can't be a good sign.

[DanB98TJ]

Originally posted by mrblaine
Impressions of the needle bearings worn into the trunnion from driving in straight lines too much.

The axleshaft U-joints would be the last place I'd expect to see that, especially since the Jeep has seldom seen prolonged freeway driving. The shafts are the originals, along with the U-joints, and have just over 45k miles on them.

I wonder if this is what is making the noise in the front end of the Cherokee I drive at work. So much for swapping axleshafts with it...not that I'd do anything like that.

[Iceman]

Dan, also check to see if your crossmember is solid. That's what happened to mine -> the bolts on the Tcase skid/cross member came a little loose and that caused my Jeep to produce some noise because of the play (the whole driveline moving).
And check the rear driveshaft ujoints as well, since you mentioned it being related to the driveshaft's rotation (even though you mentioned the noise coming from the front )

[DanB98TJ]

Well, the noise seems to be gone, so either it healed itself or something I did fixed it. Had it out on the trail today and never heard it clicking.

Thanks again to everyone for the tips.

[DsrtJeeper]

Originally posted by DanB98TJ
Well, the noise seems to be gone, so either it healed itself or something I did fixed it. Had it out on the trail today and never heard it clicking.

Thanks again to everyone for the tips.

Weirdest thing!!! Mine did not make a peep last weekend either. I did find some loose cartridge joint bolts and tightened them, but that's it.

[zman]

I had the same noise in the left rear tire. Ended up being the CV joint on the rear DS. My guess is that when you lubed your CV joint it fixed the problem.

zman